Talk:Demon/@comment-71.59.226.247-20150829221311/@comment-26854283-20150917181922

@party

" When you try to actively change a race so that that race can no longer breed; when you try to actively change a race so that it can no longer feed; when you start placing a race in what are effectively concentration camps...

These things are not passive. This is not passive defense. This is active genocide at a level that places you squarely in the ranks of Ho Chi Minh, Foday Sankoh, and Ismail Enver.

Had you just been willing to settle for building walls around your territories? That would have been passive. But trying to alter people so that they can't breed is straight-up genocide.

"

Sorry party you already put a genocide under "bulding a wall"............. also changing yourself so that another race that has nothing to do with you in the first place and only now needs you because they changed themselve without your consent is not genocide its suicide. Also every culture/race can choose what they want to do and if they say we want to isolate ourselve than they can do that. If another race made themselve dependable without the consent of the other race than you cant simply blame them if they dont comply.......

It would only be genocide of the both races had a dependable union with each other and one of them chooses to leave this union, because they can survive on their own now. Than its genocide. And not if you change yourself and say "i changed my selve i depend on you now please help me" then you have to hope that the other race accepts this union.

@taunt9000

I know that you favor the goal of the mamono. But i tell you this:

The way is as important as the goal and the goal doesnt justify the means.

Mamono do the same atrocitiec as all the other nation/races who fight a war. They only use different tools.

The only thing you are doing is trying to excuse this atrocities with, only small groups are doing it, the mamono arent fully in control of their former impulses, the goverment is yet not powerfull enough and so on. Just read a bit of history and you realize that many many other did use the same excuses over and over again.

"

"So after invading a country druella destroys this country by turning it into a dark demon realm"

I don't think those many humans and soldiers who rage-surrendered during the fall of Lescatie would agree with your words"

"all people who dont get fast enough away are forcebly changed into monsters"

Druella did not lock down the border during and after the assault. People who didn't wish to live there were free to immigrate to other places."

This is also funny because you just assume to know how all the people felt in lescatie and you just assume that all people even the ones imprisoned could leave this country. Just like that you make another excuse to make the situation look better. In this fight there where definitly some people who got transformed against their will even it was by chance. They are colleteral damage but well it is war isnt it.

"That right! That's right! Keep misinterpreting my point like that!"

What did i missinterpret? That drually willingly conquered a country? That she activly transformed everyone there, oh sorry only the ones who wanted to be transformed all other got free sure,...than she stopped willingly. THis makes her less redical from the point of view of a human, especialy the ones from lescatie, who lost there home or what? Sure she could have invaded all other nations transformed all human because she is so strong willed and isnt doing that she must be a saint. I give her a medal for being "Less bad than other invaders".

"Are you saying those heroes and soldiers have nothing to do with the government organizations of the Order??"

Yes i can make that on the basis of. druella is a princess of the mamno and as you denied that the order came from the Demon Lord the goverment, invaded with her group on her own decision. Why shouldn t heroes do the same as a from the goverment uncontrolled faction of the order or human in general? "

Read the entries. The fall of Lescatie does not make the Order crumble to dust, okay? They just lost a big city.

The Order still holds a very large territory and has a large amount of population."

Population and territory doesnt say anything about the military might of a nation, england, france, have less people and territory than india but are stronger. Japan invaded china and conquered it with less people and smaller territory. Yes i one they had the better weapons and other timeline but isnt a Lilim a much better weapon than a soldier or even a hero? They lost the second strongest part of their army as stated there to only one lilim. Also if you loose the main city of you country than it is alway a heavy blow for a nation, sometime enough to destroy it. But for the, we dont really know, only the city and the surrounding are a demon realm now. Still a heavy blow as stated above.

"And so, diplomacy will work!"

You assume that i would work. But given that the demon lord cant control many mamono not even her own daughter does lessen her credibility.

"Yea I know it's sad. Collateral damage is inevitable."

Like i said like every other race/nation who are fighting a war nothing special.

Below this statement of yours just excuses. I even forgot one, blame the responsibility on the other, a really convenient one.

Again the goal of the mamono may be a good one, but the doesnt mean that everyone shares their goal and i dont mean the order with that, they obviously dont do it and it doesnt justify the means. The mamono strive for they goal and they will do everything they can in a given situation. Sometime they will use diplomacy, sometimes invasion, sometime infiltration and so on, if they can do without force good if they cant do it without force its bad but they will still do it if they have to.

Neutral faction will be pulled in this conflict either by mamono or humans, just like the elves and dwarves. Some will be happy like the dwarves some will hate it like the elves.

And if you end up as an dwarve and your wife is more willing and sexy now you will be happy. But if you end up as an elve and you have to leave your home again because of the demonic energy and invasions you will be sad. And if than someono comes to you and says "well sorry about that, that happens sometimes and it because "insert excuse here"" does that make everything allright?

The same goes for different faction, kingdoms, orgonisation and individual people on the human side.

For some the mamono are good, for other the order for even other something else and if someone other trys to turn you around they will be the bad for you.

This all is just a point of view from the different people. For you its bad if the order kill mamono and even if the mamono do something bad you just say well its not as bad as the order. On the order side there will be people who say the same thing just about the order and others will do the same about their own actions.

To end this there is no good or bad, you just decide on a path and walk on it in the believe that you are on the "good" one like everyone else.