Talk:Incubus/@comment-25075355-20150913135236/@comment-142.4.206.228-20150920134834

@Kuruni

Yes, the whole point is that the article is saying that there is no concrete defintion. That's directly contrary to your claim that NTR is definitively about cuckolding, end of story. You say "let's assume", so I'll assume you're still not convinced. I'll give you a more clear and concise source defining NTR and it's varitions that should be easier for you to follow.

http://d.hatena.ne.jp/keyword/NTR

主人公とヒロインと他の男の関係によって様々なバリエーションがある.

"There are various variations depending on the relationship between the protagonist, the heroine, and the other man."

Below in the bulleted list it gives specific examples of various variations.

The term 相思相愛, means "mutually in love" but you can plainly see some of the bulleted examples don't include that.

Here's a particularly damning example.

主人公はヒロインを狙っていたが、ヒロインは主人公を嫌っており、さっさと他の男とくっつく.

"The protagonist was aiming for the heroine, but the heroine despises the protagonist, and quickly goes with another man."

In the last case, it seems that it could apply to MGE, even if KC dislikes the genre and it will never be featured in official works or endorsed (It does go against KC's philosophy of "happy ending for everyone"). In order for a mamono to not be NTR'ed, they must be in lover relationship already, since the mechanic to prevent it in the setting is the mamono developing a preference for her husband's mana, and a distaste for other men's mana, which couldn't happen unless they were lovers, unless KC explicitly stated that mamono sense the emotion of longing from men and telepathically develop an exclusive preference for that man's mana without ever even having tasted it, then KC's settings technically leave mamono open to at least some form of NTR.

For example, what if a weak pathetic man really likes a mamono who is arrogant and has high standards for a mate like say a Dragon or something, and then she rejects him and chooses a superior man, whom she deems more worthy of her. Let's say they were classmates before she was changed into a dragon by a lilim to explain how he fell for her in the first place. This could easily serve as the rough premise for an MGE NTR fanfic or doujinshi, though not endorsed by KC because of the miserable unhappy ending for the protagonist.

As for 犯す vs rape, it's an issue of semantics. Some people feel that rape is this terrible word that implies trauma, and that they can claim they were 'raped' if they feel bad about it later even if no force or coercion was used at all at the time (lol feminazis), but that's more connotation than denotation. I would simply define it as forced intercourse, pretty straight forward, the same as the sexual meaning of 犯す. So even if any unmarried mamono in MGE will always end up enjoying the coerced sex, the fact that force was used at all automatically makes it rape by definition. The absence of trauma doesn't make it not rape. Even if unmarried mamono will never truly reject a man's advances in the end, it doesn't mean they can't be coerced to do something they would have at least initially rather not have done. I've already given the example of the ghoul, but here's another example. Consider the manticore. According to the profile, she would normally prefer to use her tail pussy for a while to become familiar with her partner before finally becoming comfortable enough to use her human vagina, but with the raging mushroom, a man could just ignore what she wants and ravish her human vagina, whether she would've wanted it at that moment or not. The fact that she will ultimately end up enjoying it doesn't make this non-rape (force was still used even though there was no trauma). Basically, just because unmarried mamono are always down to do something sexual with a man, doesn't mean that they are always down to do everything sexual, even if they'd ultimately end up enjoying it regardless. They do have their own particular preferences and quirks. But what they want can be ignored if force is used. Which makes it coerced sex. Ergo, raging mushroom is a rape enabler.

That's according to the most tradtional definition of rape. On the other hand, if your idea of 'rape' is "sex that I regret is rape", then I guess yeah 犯す is different from the most far leftwing progressive definition of rape, and no unmarried mamono is actually ever raped according to that defintion, instead they are merely forced into sex. For the purposes of MGE, I think it's fair game to go with the most traditional definition of rape in translation, rather than strictly sticking to the most modern, progressive redefinition of the term that is currently in vogue only within certain political circles.